I just don't get it sometimes...

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I just don't get it sometimes...

Postby Errosion on Mon Sep 24, 2007 7:54 am

So, as I found out earlier tonight, I have been removed from Otori for reasons of inactivity. I also find out that others in the same situation as myself did as well. So really, only one question comes to mind. Why?

After discussion with some people, I find that the only thing that has some much as come to a reason is "appearances." Then I try to look at the game, and realize, WHAT appearances?

Three, if not more, notable people in the history of both Otori and the game get booted out of a guild for Inactivity, because of appearances? I would think having their name on it would be better than not.

Just like ANY MMO, there is no reason inactivity should be punished unless it is harming the group in some fashion. So how was the inactivity of three people harming Otori?

So, I pose these questions.....discuss!
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Re: I just don't get it sometimes...

Postby Deedlee on Mon Sep 24, 2007 8:34 am

i don't see it as a problem if:
1: a message is sent beforehand explaining why..
2: user is accepted back immediately if their inactive status changes.

I know i got demoted for inactivity after being active in the clan for over a year
(hey .. remember when rank was linked to karma)
was semi-active for a month or so
got demoted for lack of participation in clan projects from samurai to ???? (insert dodgy rank here - i don't remember)

I know I have been in the clan a long long time .. have done plenty for the clan in the past (doantions, run leethal buffbot, cvc).

I didn't appreciate the "what have you done for use today/lately" outlookthe clan took but accepted it (as otori was 10-20 months ago??).
was active for over a year - but no hint of promotion back to samurai
this didn't bother me too much
when I asked a few questions I got an official response "cannot promote you from current rank to anything but std otorian"
this annoyed me a fair bit - as far as i was concerned i had been more active than most leaders (chat/cvc) (but could be just differing timezones - so i didn't see them/they didn't see me)
so - we can demote you, kick you out without a problem, but you get no special favors if you want some of your status back ...

anyhow .. i am saying this to let you know what my experience has been. I think Otori is a great clan, I will continue to be involved (not as much as the past though) but I think something or something more needs to be done to build it up again.
I am NOT saying this because i want to whine, I have no hard feeling over the leadership - I did not want to be a leader, and appreciate what the leadership has had to deal with.

so .. i have spilled my guts in the attempt for something positive to come out of it ..
if you read this and get a negative feeling .. please read another thread and feel happy and forget everything here :D

deeds.
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Re: I just don't get it sometimes...

Postby ashamalee on Mon Sep 24, 2007 12:08 pm

Just what we need eh...

As I think anyone within Otori can tell we're going through a low atm.

Since I created Otori I've always highly valued activity, and that is no different today. However as an active, long-term and beneficiary member of the past certain privileges should be granted. In this case a rank, Wise Old Master or something like that :). But we do need to appreciate our history.

In regards to Deeds, I believe I was only my little pissy hiatus in Seishuu when what you speak of went down. I"m personally happy both of you posted, because as we try to rebuild Otori, and that we need to do. Your feedback as members is all we can truly go on.


Lastly Erros you should be whitelisted, as is Deedlee and Deediee,
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Re: I just don't get it sometimes...

Postby cnutt on Mon Sep 24, 2007 4:41 pm

Sweet Jesus :(
<b>Less Hearty, More Ascendy.</b>
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Re: I just don't get it sometimes...

Postby PimpingWolfwood on Tue Sep 25, 2007 3:54 pm

In a clan that stresses activity, you want the right to be inactive? That's a little counterintuitive, isn't it? I really don't think we ask for anything crazy. We just want to see you guys every once in a while. And where our activity has taken such a dip, we didn't really have any other recourse except to start sending out warnings and bootings, hoping that would help fix the problem.

Any of the booted members who can reach our standards of activity (which aren't really all that strict) in the future will be reaccepted at that time. Or sooner, if we can work out an Old Wise man rank (or whatever Ash called it).
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Re: I just don't get it sometimes...

Postby Tibbiara on Wed Sep 26, 2007 1:04 am

I can see it both ways. I think activity is important -- it's been a standard in this clan for longer than I've even been here -- but I do agree that it comes off as harsh. I'm sorry, Erros; it really wasn't meant personally, and if you don't have a whitelist, kmail me and I'll fix it.
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Re: I just don't get it sometimes...

Postby CMurda on Wed Sep 26, 2007 10:55 am

I know I'm the last person who should be saying this, but activity is what Otori was founded upon. Even if all you can do throughout your busy day is log on, use up some adventures, and spend 15 minutes in chat, do it. If you can post a bit on the forums, do it. Make your presence known. And we have all kinds of awesome projects that are waiting for people to jump on them, and lots of people with really good ideas.

We're going through a low right now, but that doesn't mean we have to stay there. Myself, being a full-time student, along with being a part-time radio news reporter, drummer for the jazz ensemble, and acting in two mainstage shows, I really don't have the time to devote to projects. But I do the best I can to stay active, and let Otori know I'm still here, and still love this clan, like I always have. Keep your activity steady, and bootings won't happen.
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Re: I just don't get it sometimes...

Postby YaYaMcG on Wed Sep 26, 2007 1:10 pm

I think what happened here was a bit of a misunderstanding. When Erros went inactive he was told that he would be able to stay in Otori because he was old school and had been such a valued member in the past. He gave all of his stuff away to Otori and Otorians with the knowledge that he would still be here when he had more time to play.

I think what happened is that many people were not aware of this agreement. Though, I'm pretty sure ash was still around at that point, but perhaps not. It happens.
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Re: I just don't get it sometimes...

Postby topolino on Wed Sep 26, 2007 1:36 pm

To rehash what PW and murda said, when I joined Otori, it was expressed to me, in no uncertain terms, that activity was essential and expected. I knew this coming in. The problem with inactivity has merited some drastic actions. Asking nicely does not seem to do much, so the next step was inevitable.

Deeds point about leadership, however, is well-taken. We're having a similar problem with inactivity in my other clan, where I am leader. Several of our leadership have either basically gone mostly MIA (they pop in from time to time to say they're busy, and they still want to be involved, but, then, nothing) or seem to think they can rest on their laurels and do nothing. I'm not sure what I'm going to do, but I think demotions are coming. It drives me insane when leaders, in particular, know they do not have the time and/or the motivation to live up to their obligations. Yet, they do not have decency to step down. These leaders DO have a long and productive history with our clan, but we need them now, more than ever, and they're leaving us high and dry. In my opinion, leaders are supposed to, at least, be the examples of what is expected from other members.
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Re: I just don't get it sometimes...

Postby ashamalee on Wed Sep 26, 2007 6:48 pm

YaYaMcG wrote:Though, I'm pretty sure ash was still around at that point, but perhaps not. It happens.


I was having my pissy fit at this time it seems, so no I wasn't present. It seems Badmojo was also given one of these special cards. But alas the one person that would know is Tag I guess, and he's currently away.


But umm, he logged on the day it happened and not since. I'm sure he's had the ability to read any replies here and re-apply via his whitelist if he so desired.
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